Test/NPP cycle

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Younganddumb

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Hello everyone, just wanted to gather some thoughts on this. I’m currently running 350test/350npp,50mg proviron and 0.5mg adex per week with ED injections.

First two weeks where awesome pumps and strength went up almost immediately. Week three lethargy started but strength has continued to go up just very tired especially after workouts. I’m on week 5 now and lethargy seems to be getting worse and gym performance is suffering as I’m just to damn tired to workout and focus and I’m getting very weak pumps now although my strength is still going up.

Any thoughts on this? Could it be my E is getting to high? I have no sides associated with high E. BP is normal erections/libido hasn’t changed at all no oilyness (skin is dry actually). Only sides is the damn lethargy, weak pumps and my appetite doesnt seem to be right. I will be getting bloods done through LGC but Im still another 3 weeks or so away from that and not sure what to do in the meantime.
 
Could be your E is high cause i doubt .5 adex/week would crash it but its possible. Could be your prolactin levels raised slowly and now your feeling it. Could be overtraining. Its all a guess until your bloods come back
 
Why are you 3 weeks away from getting bloods done. If you’re having issues. I’d be getting blood work done asap.

I’m also assuming it’s test prop?

.5 a week of adex is pretty useless. I mean if you don’t have e symptoms I would just drop it all together. If you get estro sides I would start at .5 eod or .5 every 3 days. Adex doesn’t have the half life to handle once a week. So your estro won’t be as stable as it could be. Something like aromasin can handle maybe twice a week dose. The goal is to keep your test and estro as stable as possible.

are you experiencing any bloating? Water retention?
what lab ?
 
Its pretty hard to say whats causing it without blood work. And in all honesty it might not even be anything blood related. It could be diet, it could be training too much it could be so many different things. Go get some blood work done. I will say though, that does of AI on that low of a dose of Test could be causing some issues. That would be too much for me on that little of a dose of Test. Of course that means nothing as we all react different and you don't have bloodwork to support it. Just some food for thought.
 
Kanon said:
Why are you 3 weeks away from getting bloods done. If you’re having issues. I’d be getting blood work done asap.

I’m also assuming it’s test prop?

.5 a week of adex is pretty useless. I mean if you don’t have e symptoms I would just drop it all together. If you get estro sides I would start at .5 eod or .5 every 3 days. Adex doesn’t have the half life to handle once a week. So your estro won’t be as stable as it could be. Something like aromasin can handle maybe twice a week dose. The goal is to keep your test and estro as stable as possible.

are you experiencing any bloating? Water retention?
what lab ?
Click to expand...
I am dosing the adex 2x a week, bloodwork is 3 weeks away because itll take atleast 2 weeks to get the kit plus another week for return and processing LGC is a lil slow lol and yes its test prop.

Im probably going to drop the adex I just figured id start on .5 adex a week because when I’m on 500mg test a week with .5 adex my estro hovers around 150 pmol/l and i also figured that if estro is controlled I wont have prolactin issues but perhaps with adex and proviron my estro is being lowered to much.
 
All varia
Novitec said:
Its pretty hard to say whats causing it without blood work. And in all honesty it might not even be anything blood related. It could be diet, it could be training too much it could be so many different things. Go get some blood work done. I will say though, that does of AI on that low of a dose of Test could be causing some issues. That would be too much for me on that little of a dose of Test. Of course that means nothing as we all react different and you don't have bloodwork to support it. Just some food for thought.
Click to expand...
All variables are the same with training/diet except the upping of calories during the cycle. Yeah im gunna get bloodwork done just gunna take a bit wanted to see what you guys thought about this and if I should change anything in the meantime
 
Younganddumb said:
All varia

All variables are the same with training/diet except the upping of calories during the cycle. Yeah im gunna get bloodwork done just gunna take a bit wanted to see what you guys thought about this and if I should change anything in the meantime
Click to expand...
How often do you train and for how long?
 
I just finished 8 weeks of TPP / NPP. I cut it short form a planned 10-12 weeks.
Tried 300/300 per week, then up to 450/450 split in 3 shots m/w/f and i can say I just didn't feel overly well.
Strength definitely went up and some size gained, but nowhere near what I should have gained and thats with keeping reasonable expectations.
I know i wasn't eating anywhere near what i needed as i just couldn't get the food down so thats huge and also my sleeps werent great.

I did have lab work done and my T was elevated and almost double my TRT levels, E2 perfect and little low on prolactin.
So the gear was working and I never did doubt that part.
I am just starting to think that I may not tolerate aas or high testosterone the way i used to personally as im 40 now not 25 and somehow seem to be more sensitive maybe. I felt over stimulated almost, yet extremely lethargic and almost no drive for anything let alone to really push the workouts and weights and this isnt how your supposed to feel.

So it could possibly be that something is off a lab marker will show you or you may be like me how i felt.
Let us know what the labs tell you.
 
Jayz-23 said:
I just finished 8 weeks of TPP / NPP. I cut it short form a planned 10-12 weeks.
Tried 300/300 per week, then up to 450/450 split in 3 shots m/w/f and i can say I just didn't feel overly well.
Strength definitely went up and some size gained, but nowhere near what I should have gained and thats with keeping reasonable expectations.
I know i wasn't eating anywhere near what i needed as i just couldn't get the food down so thats huge and also my sleeps werent great.

I did have lab work done and my T was elevated and almost double my TRT levels, E2 perfect and little low on prolactin.
So the gear was working and I never did doubt that part.
I am just starting to think that I may not tolerate aas or high testosterone the way i used to personally as im 40 now not 25 and somehow seem to be more sensitive maybe. I felt over stimulated almost, yet extremely lethargic and almost no drive for anything let alone to really push the workouts and weights and this isnt how your supposed to feel.

So it could possibly be that something is off a lab marker will show you or you may be like me how i felt.
Let us know what the labs tell you.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the reply and yes I will posting when I get my labs, I’m gunna drop the AI and see if it makes a difference. Did you run any anti-prolactin drugs or AI?
 
Younganddumb said:
Thanks for the reply and yes I will posting when I get my labs, I’m gunna drop the AI and see if it makes a difference. Did you run any anti-prolactin drugs or AI?
Click to expand...

Yes I was using 1mg Arimidex with every injection m/w/f so 3mg a week, I tried with 0.5mg every injection m/w/f and was not enough as 0.5mg is what I use at TRT dose. So although the Arimidex did control e2 and keep it in a "normal" range, perhaps the Arimidex or that much of it - itself can make you feel not great. I just know I can not ditch it as I have been gyno prone even on TRT as I have a hardened small lump on one side already. I was using 0.25mg Caber 2x / week and after bloodwork I did not need to use it for that dosage of NPP I was using as I went low. So there are alot of variables and I wish I could use no AI like in my 20s and just used Nolva if needed, but thats not the case anymore I think. I may try keeping test low like TRT dose and experiment with that and 450mg NPP or Primo etc next time and see if im any better and can make gains and feel good and where i can actually train hard etc.
 
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IronRobi said:
Aside from 0.5mg/week being nowhere near enough adex to do anything, you're dosing a drug with a 2 day half-life every 3-4 days.
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Well I’ve skipped my adex dose yesterday and I woke up this morning with way less lethargy maybe placebo? I still have no high e2 symptoms. Maybe proviron with the adex is just to much for me. Bloodwork will tell me just gunna be a bit for that unfortunately. Thanks for the reply.
 
So I managed to get my bloodwork done through maple app my estrogen came back at 283 pmol/l reference is <200 my prolactin came back 21.5 reference is 2.5-17.8. Weird thing is its been a little over a week without dosing adex and few things ive noticed almost immediately was my libido shot up havent been after the wife like this in a long time lol, pumps in the gym are ridiculous again especially lower back lol and I have wayyy less lethargy.

I’m a little confused as to what to do because I still do not feel any high estrogen symptoms but yet my results came back high. I’ve been reading up on non sensitive and sensitive assay for estradiol tests and the non sensitive assay which is the standard one overestimates estradiol greatly. Could this be the case? Should I worry about those numbers if I dont feel symptoms of it? I’m continuing on with 50mg of proviron daily but have yet to introduce an AI again. Any input is appreciated thanks guys
 
Your test is beyond range so it's not necessarily a bad thing that your E2 is as well. Newer theories support the idea of synergy between test and estrogen, to a point.
 
Pretty normal bloods for a Nor. Estrogen is your friend to a degree. Estrogen and test are inter-related in a specific ratio. If the ratio is off bad things happen. The vast majority of people naturally have the ratio in line and odd say yours is no different. The prolactin is high again due to the Nor you are taking. If you can't get off while having sex then that is a great indicator it is too high for the body. Caber or if you can find it bromocriptine in low dose will bring it down. Again you don't want your prolactin so low it's ratio is out of wack as well.

Many throw an AI into the mix "just for good measure" when it is often not needed. It takes test time to breakdown so estrogen will lag which means when test is discontinued the system quite often floats in estrogen for a bit while the body gets rid of it. When I take an AI it is at the end of the cycle and it's a suicide inhibitor (aromain) so it is removed, not blocked.

Might be best to let things go depending on what your total test came back at. What did it come back at? Around 1000 if your test was 3 days after injection or 800 if 7 days? I'm assuming you are on test E or C
 
Mfg Eng said:
Many throw an AI into the mix "just for good measure" when it is often not needed. It takes test time to breakdown so estrogen will lag which means when test is discontinued the system quite often floats in estrogen for a bit while the body gets rid of it. When I take an AI it is at the end of the cycle and it's a suicide inhibitor (aromain) so it is removed, not blocked.
Click to expand...

That might explain why my back and shoulders broke out like crazy when I dropped my TRT dose.
 
I didn't read every response but two thoughts - take some time off, maybe 3 days. It can be hard when you want to get the most out of the cycle but what is three days? See how you feel after a few days of eating right, sleeping right and not pushing yourself. You can run yourself down if your lifting too much or you simply have a bug.
I wouldn't wait three weeks, I would go to a clinic and tell them your symptoms and ask if they would check your hormones too. If you don't want the hormones on your medical record, then get all the other blood work done. If its getting worse, don't wait and get it checked now just to be on the safe side.
good luck bud.
GR
 
Mfg Eng said:
Pretty normal bloods for a Nor. Estrogen is your friend to a degree. Estrogen and test are inter-related in a specific ratio. If the ratio is off bad things happen. The vast majority of people naturally have the ratio in line and odd say yours is no different. The prolactin is high again due to the Nor you are taking. If you can't get off while having sex then that is a great indicator it is too high for the body. Caber or if you can find it bromocriptine in low dose will bring it down. Again you don't want your prolactin so low it's ratio is out of wack as well.

Many throw an AI into the mix "just for good measure" when it is often not needed. It takes test time to breakdown so estrogen will lag which means when test is discontinued the system quite often floats in estrogen for a bit while the body gets rid of it. When I take an AI it is at the end of the cycle and it's a suicide inhibitor (aromain) so it is removed, not blocked.

Might be best to let things go depending on what your total test came back at. What did it come back at? Around 1000 if your test was 3 days after injection or 800 if 7 days? I'm assuming you are on test E or C
Click to expand...
I’m on test Prop 50mg ED/50mg NPP ED/50mg proviron ED. didnt get my test levels checked as I didnt want that on my record lol I figured it was irrelevant as well.
 
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